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Post by Tim on Dec 2, 2019 1:06:24 GMT -5
They are.
Mention Armenians to the average Americans and their minds will probably go right to the KarTRASHian creatures. And Kimmy K and Co. in no way represent the way real Armenians live.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Dec 2, 2019 11:00:26 GMT -5
Mention Armenians to the average Americans and their minds will probably go right to the KarTRASHian creatures. And Kimmy K and Co. in no way represent the way real Armenians live. Even worse is that people legit think Kris/Caitlyn/Kendall/Kylie are Armenian, when they're actually 100%, straight-up white. (The only reason Kylie looks vaguely-Middle Eastern is because she got loads of plastic surgery to look like Kim. She used to look like an unambiguously pale white girl.) But, because they're connected to the K@rdashians, and people are stupid, the shit they do ends up getting blamed on Armenians just like Kimmy K's antics. It's very sad that so many people (even otherwise "progressive" ones) use a trashy reality show family to beat up on a marginalized ethnicity that has experienced centuries of racism and oppression, but that's what happens when there's a severe lack of education and representation.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Dec 2, 2019 23:57:24 GMT -5
This is a REALLY good article about the arguments Turkey (and its supporters) pull out to deny the Armenian Genocide. Important reading: Notice the tendency to paint Armenians as powerful Western agents, while also playing into Western Orientalism and Imperialism for support for continued genocide denial. Racism tends to be contradictory like that.
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Post by Tim on Dec 3, 2019 0:45:17 GMT -5
What a bunch of bullsh*t!
Loved that one about them being relocated. The Nazis used that same lie about the Jews, who were being "relocated". Relocated right to the death camps.
Okay, Turkey, if there was no genocide, then where did all those Armenians go? Narnia??
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Post by BettyNewbie on Dec 3, 2019 14:04:39 GMT -5
These points especially need to be reiterated: Look around on the internet, and you will sometimes see people either refer to Armenia as an "Eastern European country" or call Armenians "white Europeans" (the latter especially tends to come up whenever Kimmy K is getting criticized for Black appropriation). This is not only wrong, but also very, very harmful. Whether you know it or not, you empower Turkish fascism and Armenian Genocide denial when you racialize Armenians as white/European. You feed into the myth that Armenians aren't indigenous to Asia Minor and are instead Western invaders/imperialists. When you say that Armenians are "all wealthy" or have "white privilege" because of Kimmy K (who, I repeat, is HALF-WHITE), you fuel Turkish conspiracy theories about the Armenian diaspora being a powerful/sinister/terrorist lobby. Yes, it's true that the US Census classifies Armenians and all other MENA people as "white," but that is because this racist-ass country used to ban non-white people from immigrating here, so MENA people desperately trying to escape genocide and oppression in their homelands had no choice but to fight for "legal whiteness" to be able to come here. But, that "whiteness" was never anything more than de jure. MENA people, regardless of religion, still get characterized as "dirty terrorists" and called hateful slurs like "raghead," "camel jockey," and "sand n***er." They still get treated like foreigners even if they were born and raised in this country. Whatever "whiteness" they have is very limited and conditional. TL;DR -- A single, very wealthy and very ignorant woman who happens to be half-Armenian is no excuse to whitewash an entire ethnicity that has faced almost nothing but racism and oppression for the last 100+ years, and you empower their oppressors when you do so.
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Post by Tim on Dec 3, 2019 18:31:44 GMT -5
Which is wrong. For one thing, Armenia is in ASIA.
What good have Kimmy K and her family done for the Armenian community? Not much, except give a false impression that they're all a bunch of spoiled rich people.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Dec 3, 2019 22:52:56 GMT -5
Which is wrong. For one thing, Armenia is in ASIA. I think some people may instinctively toss Armenia into Eastern Europe because it was once part of the Soviet Union, and in the popular consciousness, Soviet Union = Russia... But, don't people realize that even much of Russia itself is located in Asia? And, go look at a map of the Soviet Union and notice all of those republics that end in "-stan." Much of the USSR was in Asia, not just Armenia. Yet another reason why you shouldn't call Armenians "Eastern European" is that you erase the racism they have historically faced in Russia. Eastern Armenia (aka. present-day Armenia) was literally a Russian territory from the end of the Russo-Persian War (1828) all the way up until the death of the Soviet Union (1991), and while Russia didn't inflict genocide on Armenians (unless you count Stalin's purges), they did colonize them and force their language/culture onto them. Even nowadays, Armenians in Russia still face state-sanctioned racism and even violent hate crimes precisely because they are NOT Slavic Eastern Europeans. Russia even has its own slur for Armenians (and other Caucasian ethnicities): "chernozhopy," aka. "black ass." What good have Kimmy K and her family done for the Armenian community? Not much, except give a false impression that they're all a bunch of spoiled rich people. I know. I almost wish she and her full-siblings had just disowned their Armenian side and changed their last name to "Jenner." From what I've seen online, real Armenians want nothing to do with that stupid family.
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Post by Tim on Dec 4, 2019 12:05:00 GMT -5
I agree. All their fame and fortune comes from the Jenner side of the family anyway, namely "Momager" Kris (not a drop of Armenian blood in her).
I can't blame real Armenians wanting nothing to do with them. They look and say "This is not what our culture is like at all.".
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Post by BettyNewbie on Dec 18, 2019 23:59:27 GMT -5
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Post by Tim on Dec 19, 2019 12:28:43 GMT -5
Yeah, the Armenian people have no friend in Orange Hitler. He doesn't want to offend his fellow Fascist in Turkey.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Dec 19, 2019 20:04:03 GMT -5
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Post by Tim on Dec 20, 2019 0:25:47 GMT -5
You're right. What a weak ass threat. "Expose" a fact that Americans have known for decades.
Perhaps Erdogan can then "expose" the murder of the Jews during the Holocaust.
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Post by Squad 51 on Dec 23, 2019 14:22:04 GMT -5
This never ends well if it continues this way. I mean, we Germans also have a burden on our shoulders with the genocide in our former colonies in Africa. This is also not over yet. We recognize the Jewish and Armenian genocide but NOT the one at the Hereros.
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Post by Tim on Dec 23, 2019 18:27:47 GMT -5
This never ends well if it continues this way. I mean, we Germans also have a burden on our shoulders with the genocide in our former colonies in Africa. This is also not over yet. We recognize the Jewish and Armenian genocide but NOT the one at the Hereros.
Oh yeah, what they got up to in what is now Namibia. Kind of a proto-Holocaust in some way.
One of the Colonial Governors there was the father of Hermann Goering, I believe.
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Post by Squad 51 on Dec 24, 2019 10:14:50 GMT -5
Could be. Can't really say if it's the truth. I have to research here.
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