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Post by Tim on Feb 16, 2021 0:20:57 GMT -5
Sad, but true, I'm afraid. This is the world we're in now.
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Post by adzpower on Feb 16, 2021 8:21:35 GMT -5
I'm glad that Amy Acker in particular has spoken up because I had thought she was on good terms with Joss which apparantly she still is. But I appreciate her saying that whilst she didn't have a negative experience, she sides with and supports those who did. I've always liked her and I think her response was good.
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Post by Squad 51 on Feb 16, 2021 10:32:42 GMT -5
Yeah, some people online really do make it hard and are expecting stars to post their every detail online. I mean poor Holly got so much crap for not posting about Shannen online when she did so privately, and they talk this way. But, in the age of social media, if someone doesn't say anything online, magically the trolls come out for them. We have to remember that most of the stars grew up in a pre-Social media age, so communicating privately in the 80s or 90s was how it always was. That is the problem with social media, you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. More reasons to stay away from social media - for good. But if you're a celeb, you obviously have no choice.  |
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Post by Tim on Feb 16, 2021 12:23:27 GMT -5
I'm glad that Amy Acker in particular has spoken up because I had thought she was on good terms with Joss which apparantly she still is. But I appreciate her saying that whilst she didn't have a negative experience, she sides with and supports those who did. I've always liked her and I think her response was good.
Nice that she supports her former co-stars. Another voice added.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Feb 26, 2021 13:52:29 GMT -5
I found this to be a good article: The Rise and Fall of Joss Whedon, and the Myth of the Hollywood Feminist HeroI've always felt that Whedon's "feminist" cred was massively overblown and undeserved. If he was always such a "master" at creating strong/interesting female characters, then why is Buffy still the only female-driven thing on his resume? Let's not pretend that Angel, Firefly, and Dr. Horrible were particularly "feminist" or female-centric. And, Dollhouse's premise straight-up bordered on old school misogyny, and his MCU work isn't any less male-centric than the rest of the franchise. And, the less said about his old Wonder Woman script, the better. It feels more and more like Buffy was just a "lightning in a bottle" moment. The show came around at a time when strong/interesting female characters weren't that common, especially in things aimed at teenagers. I think a lot of critics who loved the show used it to attach a "feminist" label to Whedon that just wasn't reality (because god forbid they enjoy the show independently of its creator), and Whedon himself exploited the label to rack up cred as an "auteur." |
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Post by Squad 51 on Feb 26, 2021 14:03:45 GMT -5
Interesting to read. That he could live that long with this reputation. You have to wonder here, really.
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Post by Tim on Feb 26, 2021 18:05:51 GMT -5
Good article, Betty.
Now that the truth is out, Whedon can't hide anymore.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Mar 1, 2021 13:09:03 GMT -5
Sharing this because it's a great example of why Whedon doesn't take 100% of the credit for Buffy:
Read More: www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/buffy-vampire-slayer-at-20-gail-berman-how-show-made-air-how-could-come-back-983847When people talk about how great and groundbreaking Buffy is, they're thinking of the TV show and not the B-movie from 1992. Well, that TV show would've never existed without Gail Berman. She was the one who wanted to give Buffy a second chance on the small screen, not Whedon.
I wouldn't be surprised if she may have also been behind the decision to make the series an hour-long dramedy instead of a straight comedy like the movie was. Reading this article, it feels like Berman saw storytelling potential in the idea that Whedon himself did not.
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Post by Tim on Mar 1, 2021 13:53:28 GMT -5
Gail Berman deserves as much credit, if not, more, than Whedon.
Yes, the 1992 movie was bad, but without it, there would have been no television series at all.
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Post by Squad 51 on Mar 1, 2021 17:08:20 GMT -5
Yep, definitely! The only credit goes to her since she even mentioned to give it a chance on TV.
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Post by Tim on Mar 1, 2021 18:23:43 GMT -5
Wish Buffy was real. She would take care of Whedon.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Mar 1, 2021 21:41:10 GMT -5
The Buffy movie doesn't exactly hold up to the even the most basic feminist lens like the show does: - Buffy is portrayed as a one-note valley girl stereotype.
- Her "special power" for detecting vampires is literally menstrual cramps.
- All of her main allies (Merrick, Pike) and villains (Lothos, Vampire Pee-Wee) are male.
- Her female friends are portrayed as useless, ditzy b***hes that hold her back from her destiny.
- Pike becomes nearly as adept at killing vampires as Buffy, despite having no training or magical powers, whatsoever.
- Buffy has several fanservice shots in tight/revealing clothing. Some might be tempted to blame executive meddling, but all of this is right there in the original script. These ideas are 100% Whedon. Maven of the Eventide gets into some of this in her review of the movie.The fact that none of the above made it into the show is likely a testament to the aforementioned Gail Berman and other producers and writers who refined Whedon's idea into something more innovative and less cliche. |
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Post by Tim on Mar 2, 2021 0:23:01 GMT -5
Could be.
Gail Berman may be the unrecognized hero here.
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Post by Astral Echo on Mar 2, 2021 10:44:17 GMT -5
That's really interesting. Just like Charmed, there is always a great woman behind the man. In both cases though, the woman was sidelined and the man took the credit.
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Post by BettyNewbie on Mar 2, 2021 12:18:52 GMT -5
That's really interesting. Just like Charmed, there is always a great woman behind the man. In both cases though, the woman was sidelined and the man took the credit. Sad, but true.  Even when it comes to something like feminism and the portrayal of female characters, people are more likely to heap praise onto a man who doesn't necessarily deserve the honor than give even the slightest bit of credit to a woman. Women like Gail Berman, Marti Noxon, and Jane Espenson don't get anywhere near enough credit for what they contributed to Buffy. It is likely because of them (plus many others) that the show was far more than the shallow parody of the movie. |
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